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	<title>Comments on: Fairy Tale?</title>
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		<title>By: &#187; Educational (Anti)depressants: Some Links The Oxide&#8217;s Blog</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-1098</link>
		<dc:creator>&#187; Educational (Anti)depressants: Some Links The Oxide&#8217;s Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Sep 2008 14:22:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-1098</guid>
		<description>[...] Now, Ms. Frizzle explains how NYC&#8217;s Progress Report system is affecting her school (A Fairy Tale), and the Tempered Radical contemplates the costs of cutting out higher order thinking skills to up [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Now, Ms. Frizzle explains how NYC&#8217;s Progress Report system is affecting her school (A Fairy Tale), and the Tempered Radical contemplates the costs of cutting out higher order thinking skills to up [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Amy</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-763</link>
		<dc:creator>Amy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 20:08:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-763</guid>
		<description>It was so refreshing to read what you wrote.  I remember what is was like too to actually work with a class and TEACH....before the days of data driven instruction, before the days of Klein and the joke of a system he&#039;s created....    Which is why I left.   It&#039;s sad to say, but after 10 years of teaching and then a few more of experiencing what &quot;teaching&quot; has become, I realized that what I was doing was NOT helping students become learners.  I was helping them become robots who were ready for a test, to help earn the city money, that would ultimately not be spent directly on the population of students with which I was working.   I hate that I left the classroom....but I will never regret leaving behind the mess that the DOE is today.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was so refreshing to read what you wrote.  I remember what is was like too to actually work with a class and TEACH&#8230;.before the days of data driven instruction, before the days of Klein and the joke of a system he&#8217;s created&#8230;.    Which is why I left.   It&#8217;s sad to say, but after 10 years of teaching and then a few more of experiencing what &#8220;teaching&#8221; has become, I realized that what I was doing was NOT helping students become learners.  I was helping them become robots who were ready for a test, to help earn the city money, that would ultimately not be spent directly on the population of students with which I was working.   I hate that I left the classroom&#8230;.but I will never regret leaving behind the mess that the DOE is today.</p>
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		<title>By: jd2718</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-504</link>
		<dc:creator>jd2718</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Feb 2008 23:20:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-504</guid>
		<description>When the emphasis for teachers is not on teaching, there is something wrong.

I analyze data. I used to get paid for it. My job title was &quot;analyst.&quot; Some people have that skill set. You clearly do. Most teachers do not. And to divert, distract, frustrate, or infuriate them by saying learning to &quot;talk data&quot; matters more than working on real professional growth, that stinks.

I analyze data to look for things going right, or going wrong. If I am simultaneously being judged on that data, I have incentive to cheat, to analyze &quot;differently,&quot; to choose numbers that make me look good. These people have the power and the will to corrupt everything good, including numbers.

These sorts of demeaning tasks (making non-data people sift through numbers, making teachers waste class time &quot;documenting&quot; instead of teaching, etc) are what Bloomberg uses as a management tool. It helps foster a sense of insecurity, and keeps the young suits clawing for their jobs. It is not something we, as teachers, should expect. MBA&#039;s and JDs sell their souls for their jobs - we do not.

Jonathan</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When the emphasis for teachers is not on teaching, there is something wrong.</p>
<p>I analyze data. I used to get paid for it. My job title was &#8220;analyst.&#8221; Some people have that skill set. You clearly do. Most teachers do not. And to divert, distract, frustrate, or infuriate them by saying learning to &#8220;talk data&#8221; matters more than working on real professional growth, that stinks.</p>
<p>I analyze data to look for things going right, or going wrong. If I am simultaneously being judged on that data, I have incentive to cheat, to analyze &#8220;differently,&#8221; to choose numbers that make me look good. These people have the power and the will to corrupt everything good, including numbers.</p>
<p>These sorts of demeaning tasks (making non-data people sift through numbers, making teachers waste class time &#8220;documenting&#8221; instead of teaching, etc) are what Bloomberg uses as a management tool. It helps foster a sense of insecurity, and keeps the young suits clawing for their jobs. It is not something we, as teachers, should expect. MBA&#8217;s and JDs sell their souls for their jobs &#8211; we do not.</p>
<p>Jonathan</p>
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		<title>By: miss brave</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-500</link>
		<dc:creator>miss brave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 23:45:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-500</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m new, so I don&#039;t have any previous experience to compare.  But I can tell you that I have seen teachers with years of experience come out of their data PD sessions crying -- crying! -- because they&#039;re so overwhelmed by the sheer volume of information they&#039;re being asked to collect, especially because they&#039;re not given any time to review or analyze said information.

We too are prepping for our dreaded Quality Review, and teachers are being told that they are expected to be able to speak thoroughly not only about every single child in their class but about class trends in data grouped by categories like gender (i.e., are the boys improving at a faster rate than the girls?).  But everyone feels like they&#039;re so busy COLLECTING the data that they have no time to ANALYZE the data...plus every other week we&#039;re asked to organize our collected data in a different way for the purpose of consistency.  So it&#039;s not really about what helps the teacher figure out how to help the students; it&#039;s about whose data collection binder looks the most like everyone else&#039;s so an outside interpreter like Mr. Quality Review Man can be satisfied that everyone is the same.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m new, so I don&#8217;t have any previous experience to compare.  But I can tell you that I have seen teachers with years of experience come out of their data PD sessions crying &#8212; crying! &#8212; because they&#8217;re so overwhelmed by the sheer volume of information they&#8217;re being asked to collect, especially because they&#8217;re not given any time to review or analyze said information.</p>
<p>We too are prepping for our dreaded Quality Review, and teachers are being told that they are expected to be able to speak thoroughly not only about every single child in their class but about class trends in data grouped by categories like gender (i.e., are the boys improving at a faster rate than the girls?).  But everyone feels like they&#8217;re so busy COLLECTING the data that they have no time to ANALYZE the data&#8230;plus every other week we&#8217;re asked to organize our collected data in a different way for the purpose of consistency.  So it&#8217;s not really about what helps the teacher figure out how to help the students; it&#8217;s about whose data collection binder looks the most like everyone else&#8217;s so an outside interpreter like Mr. Quality Review Man can be satisfied that everyone is the same.</p>
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		<title>By: Julie</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-499</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 21:41:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-499</guid>
		<description>I have a secret. 
My school has been doing documentation for four years now, and I/my documents have consistently been praised and held as an example. 
The secret is that 1)it&#039;s total BS, 2)I rarely use it, 3)nothing actually happens with the data I collect. It&#039;s basically just writing a bunch of stuff down. I&#039;m used to it now and don&#039;t complain, but yeah, it&#039;s a pain and yeah, it&#039;s ridiculous. And yep, we should certainly be given time and PD to document and discuss the data. 

The CEP is also complete and utter BS. It&#039;s classic educational doublespeak and needless overexplanations. The things in there don&#039;t really happen, or if they do, don&#039;t actually DO any good. (At least in my experience. I told this to my friendly AP, and she completely agreed with me. [She&#039;s one of two sane and competent members of our admin]). 

It&#039;s scary how much in this system is a fairy tale, but what&#039;s worse is that the futures of a million children are at stake. *They* are the ones paying for this sham.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have a secret.<br />
My school has been doing documentation for four years now, and I/my documents have consistently been praised and held as an example.<br />
The secret is that 1)it&#8217;s total BS, 2)I rarely use it, 3)nothing actually happens with the data I collect. It&#8217;s basically just writing a bunch of stuff down. I&#8217;m used to it now and don&#8217;t complain, but yeah, it&#8217;s a pain and yeah, it&#8217;s ridiculous. And yep, we should certainly be given time and PD to document and discuss the data. </p>
<p>The CEP is also complete and utter BS. It&#8217;s classic educational doublespeak and needless overexplanations. The things in there don&#8217;t really happen, or if they do, don&#8217;t actually DO any good. (At least in my experience. I told this to my friendly AP, and she completely agreed with me. [She's one of two sane and competent members of our admin]). </p>
<p>It&#8217;s scary how much in this system is a fairy tale, but what&#8217;s worse is that the futures of a million children are at stake. *They* are the ones paying for this sham.</p>
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		<title>By: Miss Teacher</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-498</link>
		<dc:creator>Miss Teacher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 21:33:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-498</guid>
		<description>Oops!  Let me try again.  

I, unlike many teachers, agree with the documenting process.  The problem I have is that we are not given the time or the professional development necessary to really know how to use the data.  This is what makes the whole thing look like a show.  If we are expected to collect all of these numbers and analyze them, then we should be given at least one more prep. in the day as well as receive training in how to deal with all the numbers.  We also need access to computers that can run these numbers.  There is no reason we should be (by hand) running any of these numbers.  Also, there we should be looking at observational data.  This is a whole separate skill set that teachers should be explicitly taught.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oops!  Let me try again.  </p>
<p>I, unlike many teachers, agree with the documenting process.  The problem I have is that we are not given the time or the professional development necessary to really know how to use the data.  This is what makes the whole thing look like a show.  If we are expected to collect all of these numbers and analyze them, then we should be given at least one more prep. in the day as well as receive training in how to deal with all the numbers.  We also need access to computers that can run these numbers.  There is no reason we should be (by hand) running any of these numbers.  Also, there we should be looking at observational data.  This is a whole separate skill set that teachers should be explicitly taught.</p>
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		<title>By: Miss Teacher</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-497</link>
		<dc:creator>Miss Teacher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 21:29:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-497</guid>
		<description>I, unlike many teachers, agree with the documenting process.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I, unlike many teachers, agree with the documenting process.</p>
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		<title>By: Ms. M</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-491</link>
		<dc:creator>Ms. M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 04:34:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-491</guid>
		<description>I feel like a huge portion of what we do as teachers these days it just to &#039;look like we&#039;re doing something.&#039; From conference notes to bulleting boards to all this data collection that no one really uses, it&#039;s crazy.

The CEP feels like another thing that&#039;s just for show.  Things get written that are not even looked at again let alone followed. Lone teachers write sections that should come of the result of problem solving and reflection by a group. And you&#039;re right, who is checking these things to see that they are followed through on?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel like a huge portion of what we do as teachers these days it just to &#8216;look like we&#8217;re doing something.&#8217; From conference notes to bulleting boards to all this data collection that no one really uses, it&#8217;s crazy.</p>
<p>The CEP feels like another thing that&#8217;s just for show.  Things get written that are not even looked at again let alone followed. Lone teachers write sections that should come of the result of problem solving and reflection by a group. And you&#8217;re right, who is checking these things to see that they are followed through on?</p>
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		<title>By: Nancy Cavillones</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-488</link>
		<dc:creator>Nancy Cavillones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 01:51:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-488</guid>
		<description>A lot to think about, and similar things are happening at my school, though we were not very good to begin with. I feel like we are just playing the game and doing what we need to do to get a proficient rating...the whole quality review process seems shallow to me, at least, from what I&#039;ve seen in action.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A lot to think about, and similar things are happening at my school, though we were not very good to begin with. I feel like we are just playing the game and doing what we need to do to get a proficient rating&#8230;the whole quality review process seems shallow to me, at least, from what I&#8217;ve seen in action.</p>
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		<title>By: 15 more years</title>
		<link>http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/2008/01/29/fairy-tale/#comment-487</link>
		<dc:creator>15 more years</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 01:18:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://msfrizzle.wordpress.com/?p=183#comment-487</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t even think you realize how important this post is. I read it, nodding my head the entire time. I wish that every big shot at the DOE could read it, but none of them would feel the passion that you obviously feel about teaching science, none of them would truly understand what we&#039;re doing to the kids. You are obviously getting great results on the ILS doing exactly what you&#039;re doing- why change simply for the sake of changing? Why break what&#039;s not broken? More importantly, why make children hate science by constantly prepping them for exams? (I actually said that at a grade meeting- administration agreed with me, but replied with a sad, &quot;but &#039;THEY&#039; don&#039;t want to hear it.&quot; ) What&#039;s even more aggravating is the time I spend shuffling through mounds of data could be better spent developing interesting labs, stimulating lessons, and instilling a love of science. And THAT&#039;S the real disservice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t even think you realize how important this post is. I read it, nodding my head the entire time. I wish that every big shot at the DOE could read it, but none of them would feel the passion that you obviously feel about teaching science, none of them would truly understand what we&#8217;re doing to the kids. You are obviously getting great results on the ILS doing exactly what you&#8217;re doing- why change simply for the sake of changing? Why break what&#8217;s not broken? More importantly, why make children hate science by constantly prepping them for exams? (I actually said that at a grade meeting- administration agreed with me, but replied with a sad, &#8220;but &#8216;THEY&#8217; don&#8217;t want to hear it.&#8221; ) What&#8217;s even more aggravating is the time I spend shuffling through mounds of data could be better spent developing interesting labs, stimulating lessons, and instilling a love of science. And THAT&#8217;S the real disservice.</p>
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